Posted by: BHL (Knight1285@aol.com) on Wed May 4 16:09:52 2005

> BHL-
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> This is a very good video observation.
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> More golf stuff for those interested as a way of fine tuning video analysis.
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> I would note that the back leg is not in the "L" in the golf swing either because the golf swing is optimized somewhat differently.Here are some differences that are worth thinking about that help in making the translation so you can then better apply golf swing principles to the hitting swing.
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> The grip/hand action difference is the most complex and I would save trying to analyse/understand that until all other aspects of both swings ("rotational" pattern in both golf and hitting) are understood.
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> The set-up/stance:
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> 1-head position is the MAJOR difference.In golf the head is looking down at the ball and typically the chin turns down back slightly to stabilize the axis of rotation so that during the uncoiling,the chin is often pointed more toward the back foot than straight down at the ball.(in hitting/look forward to pitcher and do NOT turn head back,just tuck chin to support rotation/uncoiling with stable axis).
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> 2-back foot is turned slightly away from perpendicular to target.This encourages a full/adequate "backswing" (?hitting term "counter-rotation").In hitting,you want to limit separation/counterrotation early as this "lengthens" the swing,often you even turn the back foot WAY toward the pitcher.In fact,with regard to the "closed front foot" idea,I would say IF you choose to focus /force a closed front foot you will almost HAVE to turn the back foot way toward the pitcher to avoid severe limitation of hip turn.I would speculate this is why the very pigeon toed stance is common now as a forced compenstaion to the closed front foot position-see on Giants ,for example, Moises Alou or Grissom).You will also need to look for overall forced compensations in players who focus on "no-stride" as opposed to stride.Accounting for this variable also helps see the more fundamental similarities of the various swings.
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> 3-Front foot is slightly open so that hip turn is not limited.
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> Bobby Jones opinion was that the set-up/start of back swing and starting down from the top were the 2 most important parts of the swing to get mechanically right.I would say the same is true in hitting.Recently there has been much focus on the complexity of the overlapping backswing and forward swing actions,but do not overlook the importance of getting the set-up and the start of the loading/"back swing" action right.
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> These set-up differences create a very different orientation of rotation.In hitting,the backswing needs to be shorter and the acceleration needs to be quicker.
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> In addition to the different set-up of the feet and head,then,in hitting
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> 4- you also start with the bat (club) already lifted up in hitting.The "counter-rotation"/backswing/separation/twist of torso/is then very abbreviated in hitting,and the down swing can later be quickened by the knees being spread more apart to provide better support for the hips turning open quickly.(Loading consists of a liftinf and a counterrotation element in both swings,but the lifting tends to be more exagerrated in hitting and the turn back more accentuated in golf,especially in the modern era).
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> The next great difference is back arm action and how this works with the shoulders/scaps/lead arm.This is somewhat complicated,but Jack addresses this well, and his "golf club" demonstration is a good one showing the different acceleration characteristics that result.The "THT" action quickens acceleration significantly.I have found the commonest source for the exact back arm sequence is usually the back arm loading sequence for the overhand throw (assuming you have learned a good rotational throw first).
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> Less complicated is the fact that lead arm action is very similar,but in baseball/hitting,you want a short swing radius when possible to shorten/quicken the swing which can be accomplished by a bent lead arm and a short bat.
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> In both golf and hitting,lead arm connection is by internal rotation of the lead arm in the shoulder socket with the elbow then staying in the swing plane and late "wrist snap" (chp/flail).In hitting,the lead arm can be bent and internally rotate and be kept firm without having to worry about "club face orientation" (which is a whole nother variable to control in golf).
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> Beyond this,the the arm and body action is VERY similar in golf.Understanding the golf swing can shed a lot of light on how the weight shift needs to synch up and how well coordinated upper and lower body motions can optimize separation/coiling and reversal,including the current Nyman "buzzword" actions of "pelvic/vertical loading".In this way,golf sheds light on the "down-up" aspects (sit-get out of chair/bow-arch) of body action in the swing.As Bobby Jines notes,it is the proper back arm/backside action that "keeps the body down" for the swing.
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> Because of the adjustment of the swing in golf including the relatively closed front foot,then,the swing is longer and the back leg does not tend to show the "L".

Hi Tom:

I am an avid watcher of the Golf Channel.

What you are saying is correct--only once did I hear the analyst discuss the "L" in the back leg that results from hip rotation. More precisely, this analyst suggested that the "L" in golf occurs in the follow through--if at all--rather than at impact.

On the other hand, the "L" shape in the back leg occurs at impact with the baseball.

Thanks again for the kind words.

Best Wishes,
BHL