Posted by: Jack Mankin (MrBatspeed@aol.com) on Wed Apr 24 09:05:43 2002

>>> as for my post at setpro, perhaps i have again misunderstood you in the past and issue by issue (each of which has generated much discussion over the years)perhaps you could correct the record...

(1)"he refuses to acknowledge that many major leaguers achieve full extension on outside pitches, despite evidence to the contrary".....if i must, i could go to the archives to cite your comments on this matter as well as the other issues discussed in my post......

(2)"he does not believe in the "whip" theory"....it is not well-documented that you disagree with the "whip theory" as well as the "kinetic chain" theory?....

(3)"whenever i discuss these matters with him, he responds with either asking me a question...then when i respond he ignores my response.....or...sometimes he will respond with a canned answer which doesn't address my points".............jack, there has been several times when this is exactly what happened in some of our exchanges and if it were that important i could go to the archives & provide examples.......

(4)i think it would be important to point out that i prefaced my remarks at setpro with "i do indeed agree with many of jack's theories....but his theories do have flaws"......is it not true that you and charley lau jr, or paul, or mike schmidt or mike epstein share many of the same theories, but that you believe each of them have at least one or more particular flaws?

jack, my post here as well as at setpro as well as any and all other posts i have made has not in any way whatsover been meant to denigrate you....i have meant absolutely no disrespect to you whatsoever and if i have misrepresented your views i truely do apologize........respectfully, grc..... <<<

Hi grc

I do not take your comments as being disrespectful. Disagreements on baseball hitting theory should not be taken personally, but clarity of positions is a must for good discussions. ---On hitting outside pitches, you attributed the following to me: “he thinks major leaguers achieve almost full hip and shoulder rotation on outside pitches, despite evidence to the contrary, as well as ‘he refuses to acknowledge that many major leaguers achieve full extension on outside pitches, despite evidence to the contrary’.....if i must, i could go to the archives to cite your comments on this matter as well as the other issues discussed in my post.”

As to your charge, “he thinks major leaguers achieve almost full hip and shoulder rotation on outside pitches, despite evidence to the contrary.” I think you should go to the archives. You must be attributing a post to me that someone else made. I would never have made a statement to that effect. -- As I am sure you know, I want the lead-arm to be fairly straight from initiation to contact. A check of the archives will verify that I have often stated that due to limited shoulder rotation and the wider hand-path required to reach outside pitches, the back-arm must be more extended at contact. The farther outside the pitch, the less the shoulders can rotate and the more extended the back-arm will be.

So grc, I do not think your statement, "he refuses to acknowledge that many major leaguers achieve full extension on outside pitches” characterized my position on hitting outside pitches correctly. It should be obvious that there will be less shoulder rotation and more back-arm extension on pitches away. But good hitters will seldom have the arms fully extended at or before contact. Full extension (“V” position) should normally occur sometime after contact – even on most outside pitches.

If you find anything in the archives or on video to dispute what I have stated, please point it out and I’ll be happy to correct or clarify.

Jack Mankin