Re: Jack Mankin and Charley Lau Jr

Posted by: K.P (kelly@pittip.net) on Mon Jan 24 05:32:13 2011

> Rotational Hitting (Jack Mankin from earlier in this thread)
> ï¿½It's easy to identify hitters that use rotational mechanics because most of them do. I'm
still waiting to hear about one that doesn't.ï¿½ --- I would agree with you that there are
many similarities of how linear and rotational hitters develop energy for the swing. Either
may or may not take a stride, or shift weight, and both rotate around some axis.
>
> But there is a vast difference in the mechanics they use to transfer that energy into bat
speed. The batter using linear mechanics initiates the swing with forces that will have the
back-hand driving past the lead-hand at contact. So, how he strides, rotates and the
forces he applies to the bat at initiation is timed and geared to achieve back-arm
extension through contact.
>
> A good rotational hitter has no thought of extending the back-arm through contact. The
mindset for his mechanics is to initiate the swing with forces that will cause the lead-hand
to arc around a more stationary back-hand coming into contact. So the forces he applies to
the bat at initiation will be far different than those of the linear hitter. He will have
expended all rotational an torque energies by contact. The power for the follow-through
will come from the batï¿½s momentum ï¿½ not his arms.
>
> So, to sum it up: The linear hitter sets up to drive (or extend) the back-hand past the
lead-hand. --- The rotational hitter sets up to have the lead shoulder and arm pull the
lead-hand around a more stationary back-hand. --- The mechanics may look similar, but
there is a vast difference in what they produce.
>
> Charlie Lau Jr. response:
> Jack, Don't make linear and rotational hitting so confusing.
> The vast majority of good hitters display the same axis to produce not only hip rotation
but also weight transfer that depends on the location of the pitch. Mark McGwire, Jeff
Bagwell,Dante Bichette and a few others are bigger and stronger than the vast majority of
todays' sluggers and can get away without displaying full hip rotation and weight transfer.
Instead of perpetuating the problem, why dont you simplify it by saying your front leg
should firm up at contact which keeps you from being to linear and too rotational? My
father said that 20 yrs ago.
> > Respectfully,
> > Charley Lau Jr.
>
> 1- Jack, your description above is brilliant, concise and to the point. I have given it to all
my AAU players. It is a very clear statement of what we are trying to teach them and in
many cases fixing in their swings.
>
> 2- Charley Lau Jr. poster/im-poster?? takes issue with Jack's statement. "Don't make
linear and rotational hitting so confusing." I for one am not in the least confused by Jack's
statement. Jr. what is confusing about it?
> Wat does Jr. offer? "your front leg should firm up at contact which keeps you from being
too linear and too rotational". Now that does confuse me. Is the goal to be partly linear and
partly rotational? Why? Which part of linear is the part to keep, which part of rotational is
the part to keep? Please answer these questions so they can be discussed. The statement
is at best too ambibuous as stated to be discussed.
> 3- "your front leg should firm up at contact which keeps you from being too linear and
too rotational". I have challenged this hitting tip before but with no material response.
> If the front leg firms up at contact, that implies to me that hip rotation, caused by the
front leg pushing the front hip back and the back leg pushing the back hip forward, is
occurring as the bat approaches contact.
> If this were true, how can hip rotation be linked to shoulder rotation through the torso in
a kinetic chain, then turned into batspeed with the hands turning with the shoulders in a
circular hand path?
> The legs power hip rotation. That energy must be transferred to shoulder rotation
through the torso. As the hips turn open and transfer energy, they slow down (equal and
opposite reaction) and form a base against which the torso can turn in order to turn the
shoulders (another equal and opposite reaction). This implies a delay between hips open
(front leg firm) and bat coming into contact with the ball. Without the delay, there is no
kinetic chain. So how can you firm up the front leg AT contact? Isn't it BEFORE contact?
> or
> Jr. - are you saying that the proper swing is to shift the weight, then turn the body as a
unit - hips, torso, shoulders, arms - into the ball? If so, then you can firm up the front leg
at contact. Do you advocate a unit turn swing? If not, how do you reconcile these conflicts?
> Major Dan
>Dear Charlie and Jack,
my dad has always taught Mr. Lau's way of hitting. However as I started to look in-to other
ways of hitting I found that most M.L.B hitters are rotational. But they do not use only
rotational concepts. For example the great Albert Pujols uses both the Lau way of hitting
and rotational concepts. For example, during his swing Pujols pulls the knob of the bat to
the outside pitch but instead of pulling it to the lower pitch Pujols tilts his shoulders and
gets the bat on a level plane to the ball. Pujols also uses top hand release but only after
reaching the power L and power V positions. To conclude, Pujols doesn't seem to be a
rotational hitter or a Lau hitter,but his hitting concepts seem more rotational than Lau.
This can however be confusing if you have no one to reinforce your concepts.

sincerely,
K.P

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