[ About ]
[ Batspeed Research ]
[ Swing Mechanics ]
[ Truisms and Fallacies ]
[ Discussion Board ]
[ Video ]
[ Other Resources ]
[ Contact Us ]
To Rahkling7 and All - as amended


Posted by: Jack Mankin and BatSpeed.com (MrBatspeed@aol.com) on Mon Aug 27 09:22:56 2001


Hi All

There was a misunderstanding in my instructions at batspeed.com. on the reply to Rahkling7. Below is the reply I intended.

To Rahkling7

This site does not discourage or shy away from controversy on batting theories. Far from it, this board and I thrive on discussions with those who have views on hitting that differ with my own. But you have gone way over the line. You have more than questioned my honor and integrity, you have blatantly called me a cheat and a liar. That, I am not able to forget, and I would close the site before I respond to you again. --- You got your money back, now burn the tape.

Jack Mankin

[see amended portion below]




Post:




Rahkling7:



I am offering this final post on this matter as an amendment to my previous post in response to the email that you (rahkling7) sent me yesterday. You indicated that you never used the words "liar" and "cheat," and that you would not hesitate to protect your rights and that we should govern ourselves accordingly. You also requested that I delete the post and you asked for an apology. I will amend my post to explain my beliefs in greater detail if that is what is necessary to convey my thoughts because, with all due respect to you, I do not want for you or anyone to believe, correctly or incorrectly, that I have mischaracterized any statement that you have alleged against me. Furthermore, I want to point out that it has never been my intent to post negative comments regarding you, but merely explained to you why I could not respond to any of your posts.


Therefore, to ensure that there is a complete understanding for the basis for my statement and beliefs, I offer this amendment to my post above so that it may be read as a continuous statement. In my opinion, as described below, I believe that you alleged statements about me and acted in a pattern that would essentially bring discredit to my honesty and integrity, which not only affects my personal relationships with others, but also my business livelihood. Furthermore, in my opinion, I believe, as described below, that you have publicly referred to me in a manner that essentially constitutes calling me a liar and a cheat. Moreover, in my opinion, I believe that the implicit message that is gained after reading your posts about me indicates that you essentially wrote on repeated that I was being dishonest, planting posts, attacking you, unwilling to accept criticism, using tough arm tactics and that I act in a manner as to only for the benefit of the making money, which in essence leads me to believe that I am being referred to as a cheat and bringing discredit upon BatSpeed.com's customers, potential customers and viewers in general.

Let's review what has occurred:


Fri Aug 24 10:44:15 2001 - Post by Anonymous


Anonymous post made by an anonymous person regarding comments that you previously posted.


Fri Aug 24 14:20:35 2001 - Post by you (rahkling7) - Titled: "Who is 'impatient and arrogant' Jack?"


Without evidence or justification, you falsely accused me of being "impatient" and "arrogant" and making an anonymous post wherein, in part, you alleged the following:


"The gloves will be off now and while the best thing to do would be to ask for a refund of my hard earned 40 bucks I think I would rather come to this board and test your theories and your stated willingness to tolerate all opinions."


Based on your statement, we subsequently asked you if you would like a refund. Your post continued:






"1) Is 'Melvin' your hand selected attack dog??????? I would love to find out the REAL truth on that one. Perhaps that is just your alias." (emphasis added).



"2) why wouldnt you SIGN your name to your personal attack on me? HMMMMMM?" (emphasis added).


You continued:




"6) You offer no evidence that I don't understand your system OTHER than I don't agree with you.... ergo.... I don't agree with Jack therefore I am BAD! Or, I can't begin to understand the complexity of this system since it took you 12 years of work to figure it out. HORSEAPPPLES! Real brilliance is in making the complex simple. Sorry Jack but cults got a bad name with the Jim Jones incident." (emphasis added).



You continued:


"9) Question 3: Although you seem unwilling to admit it there is NO explanation for Foxx' tight grip and his ability to hit the ball tremendous distances vs. the tenants of your system. The answer: obviously, Foxx is an example of a reasonable compromise or hybrid system. I can think of no others but I am sure there are several accomplished hitters in history of the game who ALSO held the bat tightly."




Herein, I believe that you were again implying, by referring to Foxx in this manner, that I wrote that anonymous post, which in not true.


Lastly, you accused me of being "akin to that of a MISSOURI MULE."


As you wrote in your own words, you accused me of using "hand selected attack dogs" (i.e. "Melvin"). You accused me of not signing my name to a "personal attack on you," which is entirely incorrect and false as neither I, nor my staff, have posted under an anonymous name. Furthermore, I believe that you accused me of a derogatory term, "Missouri Mule," which may imply to some that I am hard headed, stubborn, unwilling to reason, and moreover, the term "Mule" is used to refer to a "Jackass," which I believe may be implicit derogatory message referring to my name - Jack.


Fri Aug 24 15:16:06 2001- posted by me (Jack Mankin) - Titled: "Who is"


I responded to your offensive charges by simply stating:


"Any post that comes from my staff or me will be signed with Batspeed.com or Jack Mankin. I have never met nor talked to 'Melvin.'"


I did not refer to you in any sort of derogatory fashion, even though I believe that you had just unleashed an attack on me.


Fri Aug 24 16:45:00 2001 - Post by you (rahkling7) - Titled: "NOT Signed"


You wrote:


"Then why was your rude response which was logged into the system at 10:44:15 devoid of any signature whatsoever?" (emphasis added).


Again, you attacked my character and integrity by directly stating that I posted the anonymous post on Fri Aug 24 10:44:15 2001. I had previously informed you that "Any post that comes from my staff or me will be signed with Batspeed.com or Jack Mankin." Despite assurances that I provided to you, you accused me without good reason that I wrote that post. Thus, I believe that you were accusing me of telling lies, in which "liar" is defined by Webster's Dictionary as a person who tells lies. You persisted in stating that I was lying to you and all viewers on the website.


Fri Aug 24 19:36:55 2001 - Post by "Maximum" - Title continues as "NOT Signed"


Maximum wrote to you, "Joe A. did you change your name to rahkling7?" This is a clear reference to an individual that some have alleged was previously causing disruption and being a nuisance on the discussion board. Maximum's post also informed me and BatSpeed.com that some viewers may be perceiving you as being a disruption and a nuisance to the discussion board.


Fri Aug 24 21:34:11 2001 - Post by me (Jack Mankin) - Title continues as "NOT signed"


I again attempted to inform all that I did not write the anonymous post by merely stating:



"If I had written the 10:44:15 response, I would have signed my name to it."


Once again, I did not make reference to you or your character as you had done to me.


Sat Aug 25 09:56:29 2001 - Post by you (rahkling7) - Titled: "playing good cop bad cop jack? ntip"


You alleged that I was "playing good cop bad cop . . . ntip." Obviously, you would not accept that I did not make the Fri 10:44 post. Again, your implicit message was obvious, that I was being untruthful, lying to the viewers and playing good cop bad cop, which, as stated above, is essentially calling a person a "liar," and for a person who is operating a company, I believe a "cheat" as well.


Sat Aug 25 10:09:42 2001 - Post by you (rahkling7) - Titled: "Hitting grounders"


You persisted in stating that I made the Fri 10:44 by alleging the following,


"Even jack admitted that he was 'a better hitter' when he held the bat tight."


This is a quote from the statement that was written by the anonymous poster on Fri 10:44, not by myself, but you continued to allege that I made this post. Again, you disparaged my integrity and character.


Sat Aug 25 14:00:12 2001 - Post by me (Jack Mankin) - Titled: "Hitting grounders"


Once again, in this post I informed you that I did not write the Fri 10:44 post by respectfully stating the following to you:


"Hi Rahkling7


You still persist in associating me to a post I never wrote. Everyone who has studied my work knows I would never state that I was "a better hitter" when I held the bat tight. A bat gripped tight (especially the top-hand) causes many problems for hitters who use top-hand-torque and similar mechanics.--- If you had studied and understood the material in the video, as you said you did, you would know my position on the 'grip.'"


Sat Aug 25 15:27:22 2001 - Post by you (rahkling7) - Titled: "You wrote it & you know it!"


In the title of this post you stated, "You wrote it & you know it!" (emphasis added).


I believe that you continued to discredit and disparage my integrity and honor, which further implied that I was not a believable person and not someone who could be trusted at their word. Additionally, at about this time, other viewers were beginning to provide you with information to back-up what I had informed you. You stated in part:


"if you hadn't you would have written a response to my orginal three questions because they are so damaging to your theories. You haven't responded because you ALREADY have and you have shown your TRUE colors!" (emphasis added).


"I KNOW your position on the grip HENCE my question regarding Jimmie FOXX!!!!!!!! The video is about your system NOT about how jack holds the bat when HE hits! You used an alias and what you now you are claiming not to be an "anonymous" post that attacked me personally in hopes I would just run and hide in the weeds. I started cooking and did so in a respective and professional manner but the oven is being turned up to 450 now so if you cant stand the heat get out of the kitchen!"


...


jack you have spent a lot of time on your system. It is understandable to be defensive about it... obnoxious is another thing . . . !" (emphasis added).


Your post appeared to be written in an angry tone, and accused me again of making an anonymous post even though you had been informed several times that this was entirely false. Additionally, you referred to me as being "obnoxious," (emphasis added), which refers a person who is objectionable, hateful, offensive, very unpleasant, when I believe that I remained reserved and collected throughout this matter.


Sat Aug 25 20:53:24 2001 - Post by Mark H. - Title continued "You wrote it & you know it!"


Mark H., a board viewer and writer, wrote to you and indicated that "Two things seem apparent to [him]:"


"1. You need to carefully reread everything you can find on this site. You don't really grasp, IMHO, the mechanic described here. Slow down, read it all again, and then post some calm specific questions on items with which you still disagree...


2. Your conflict resolution skills need a lot of development." (emphasis added).


Sat Aug 25 21:28:42 2001 - Post by "Mark H." - Titled continued "NOT signed!"


Mark H. asked you, "How do you know who posted the 10:44 response" indicating that neither you, nor anyone, has knowledge as to who may have made that post.


Mark H. continued to provide you with additional evidence that "in the year or so that [Mark has] been studying this site, [he has] been impressed with Jack's open, non defensive attitude when discussing hitting. He has proved to me, over the past year, that, even when provoked, he has the patience and manners of a gentleman. You on the other hand, seem excitable, with a short trigger." Mark H. provided you with an independent assessment of my "patience" and "manners of a gentlemen" and I believe that he was further informing you that I was not the type of person to engage in the tactics that you alleged.


Sun Aug 26 06:42:11 2001 - Post by you (rahkling7) - Title continued "NOT signed!"


You stated, "Could there be MORE THAN ONE jack?" (emphasis added). I believe that this was another implication that you alleged that I was playing the roles of two people, when I repeatedly informed you that neither myself, nor my staff, had written the 10:44 post or any anonymous post. I think that your statement once again implies that I am a dishonest person and am attempting to deceive the discussion board viewers by playing the role of many persons.


Sun Aug 26 06:40:39 2001 - Post by you (rahkling7) - Title continued "You wrote it & you know it!"


You informed a viewer and writer on the board, Larry B., of the following:


"Larry, you were right about one thing! In a thread below you state that there is 'plenty of controversy to come' . You were right about that one brother!"


Your intentions by this statement appear obvious to me as I believe that you were implying that you wanted to cause "controversy" for BatSpeed.com and me.


Sun Aug 26 06:26:54 2001 - Post by you (rahkling7) - Title continued "You wrote it & you know it!"


You continued to falsely accuse myself and BatSpeed.com of planting individuals who post on this website, which I cannot state strongly enough that it is absolutely inaccurate. You stated:


"My inital questions were just in the were in a calm and deliberate manner. I was repaid with the venom of "melvin" who must be a batspeed.com PLANT .. there is no other explanation. jack saying he has never heard of the guy is a flag in and of itself.. a guy who says "let jack have him?". A comment like that would only come from a long time board participant or a personal student.. in any event someone KNOWN to jack. Those questions were directed to jack and the "anonymous" response used the personal pronoun "I". In addition, compare the writing styles ;-).... the one above in this thread and the one of "anonymous". GOTCHA! ...


The only 'clarity' I require is reasonable explanantions to my first set of questions, of course jack has put his 2 cents in already. If he hasn't why in the world wouldnt he have already done so?... I offer that as further proof that "anonymous" is jack. PLz don't tell me about a busy schedule..... I'm begging you...


BTW... if anyone else would have have not taken offense to Melvin and anonymous then I suggest you get a job at the U.N...


ps: I have reread and rewatched this system again and again and just becoem more and more convinced of my conclusions. Is there anybody who would care to debate? Nobody has stepped up yet.. at least thats the official party line!.. 'uh no we have no problems at the Chernobyl nuclear facility'." (emphasis added).


I believe that some of these statements were malicious and do not merit further comment, as they are merely more of the same.


Sat Aug 25 18:26:45 2001 - Post by Mike M. - Titled: "Tape is awesome/Lunging-need help"


Mike M. wrote a favorable post about "The Final Arc" instructional tape, but indicated that he had additional questions. Mike M. wrote the following:


"Jack,


I recently purchased your video and after repetitive daily drills, my 11 year old daughter has drastically increased her bat speed and improved her mechanics compared to her old "armsy" swing. Yesterday, I video taped her hitting pitches from a batting machine with her new rotational swing and she was driving the ball very well, with authority. When I video tape her swing during her daily drills, she keeps her weight back and has a "perfect swing" However, after watching her slow-motion swing yesterday vs. "live" pitching, I noticed that she still lunges slightly, especially on fast pitching. She is lunging less than she did with her old swing but I'm wondering if there's anything I can do to prevent her slight lunging problem.


Just a note, my daughter had the highest average and best power numbers during her 11-12 yr old season. I incorporated these changes in her swing to bring her to the next level. After seeing the results of her new swing during batting practices, it looks like it will. Just help me with this lunging thing.

Thanks
"


Sun Aug 26 06:36:59 2001 - Post by you (rahkling7) - Title continued: "Tape is awesome/Lunging-need help"


You responded to Mike M., a BatSpeed.com viewer, writer and customer who posted a favorable comment about the instructional tape and had a couple of questions. You, however, erroneously and falsely implied that I and/or my staff pretended to be Mike M. or that we planted the Mike M. post and that the favorable post on the discussion board was written at our direction, which was , in essence, to drum up support so that I could sell more tapes. Your post is as follows:


"all of a sudden we have a post where a NEW student is doing everything right.. 'after daily repetitive drills' and hitting from a 'batting machine'.. OMG... I dont have to know that a woods kitty has this way come when I smell the stink of the skunk in the car! Sorry, this is just TOO much! Really folks I don't believe in black helicopters but this stuff is as transaparent as a piece of cellophane...


My apologies to the poster if you are in any way legit but you just showed up in the wrong place at the wrong time. In any event, if this is legit and she is hitting the ball she MUST have some linear arm movement." (emphasis added).


Once again, your allegations that I, and/or my staff, and/or someone at my direction made the post from Mike M. are so far from the truth that they do not merit any consideration. Obviously, if this matter is pursued, we will produce all necessary documentation to show that Mike M.'s purchase and subsequent favorable post was in no way affiliated with BatSpeed.com, as neither was the anonymous post. Notably, you offered an apology to Mike M. in the event that his post was "legit," but you gave no such apology to BatSpeed.com or myself.


Sun Aug 26 12:18:57 2001 - Post by me (Jack Mankin) - Title continued: "Tape is awesome/Lunging-need help"


I made a post to Mike M. in regards to his questions and comments and therein I provided the following response to the attack that Mike M. received from you:


"I wish to apologize for any insult you received to your integrity for posting on the board. Steps have been taken to see that this person is removed from this board."


My statement was in reference to you, but I made no derogatory statement about you or regarding you in a derogatory manner whatsoever. Additionally, it was at this time that I asked Brian at BatSpeed.com to post a statement which would inform you that you were perceived to be a disruption to the discussion board and that any further posts you made on the discussion board would be deleted, but that you would have one more opportunity to voice any comments that you may have. I further informed Brian that we should refund your money since you seemed dissatisfied with the tape.


Sun Aug 26 12:15:57 2001 - Post by Brian at BatSpeed.com - Titled "rahkling7 - Notice"


After all of the perceived false, inaccurate, and defamatory statements that you alleged against myself, BatSpeed.com as a whole, individuals who made posts at BatSpeed.com, and in general we believed that you were harassing and demeaning our viewers, we wrote a post to you indicating the following:


"[Y]our recent activity on this discussion board disrupts the professional integrity of this board and our desire to maintain a forum that will assist our viewers in understanding the baseball and softball swing. We believe that you have taken an unfortunate path to achieve your desire to harm the integrity and stability of this board by harassing and demeaning our patrons, erroneously and falsely accusing Jack and others of posting under an alias, not furthering a discussion of the swing, and overall you are disrupting the primary goal of this discussion board - to assist others in understanding the mechanics used in the baseball and softball swing...


Therefore, you have one last chance (even though many have already been provided) to respond to this post, directly below this post (not on a new thread), so long as your post does not use foul language or threaten anyone; however, all of your future posts at BatSpeed.com will be deleted in their entirety, without comment and regardless of content. All posts that respond to your post will also be deleted. Additionally, if we believe that you post under a different name, then those posts will also be deleted. At this time, we do not intend to delete any of your previous posts from this board....


You are encouraged to return the tape for a refund as we believe that would be in everyone's best interest.


It is truly unfortunate that this sort of action has to be taken on a discussion board that merely attempts to assist youth, parents and players of all ages in understanding the baseball and softball swing.



Respectfully,



Brian

BatSpeed.com"


This post speaks for itself.


Sun Aug 26 14:06:23 2001 - Post by you (rahkling7) - Titled: "INTEGRITY and STABILITYRE: rahkling7 - Notice"


In your response you alleged various comments, such as:


"the first ATTACKS were done by Melvin and anonymous. I even apologized in advance of the post about what a great tape it was if I were wrong. Of course Melvin and anonymous were never censored. As a matter of fact batspeed.com loathes playing big brother.. supposedly, when I asked about deleting melvin's post...


Truth is brian/jack whoever you are is that you are ruining dreams. You are not "assisting.... in understanding the swing". You are SELLING a system! Players are putting their hopes in your hands! You are unwilling to address the issues I have raised. What are you afraid of? Do you love the almighty dollar this much? ...


I pray that you don't delete these posts.. it may save a dream!


I agree that I am causing problems with the STABILITY of the entire system you promote. That was NOT my goal when I asked the questions but I am not one to run away when tough arm tactics are used on me. Are you willing to accept ANY criticism?... Answer ANY question that challenges the precepts of your system?


Truthfully I think I would file suit against batspeed.com if I didnt have venue problems to deal with... just so the truth would come out and lives wouldn't be negatively impacted. Guess what my profession is! FYI I have printed out all the appropriate posts... so if you do delete them I will have written record.


I'll leave you with this.....Maybe it wasn't jack.. maybe it was brian!"


You were given free reign to air all comments that you had. You again implicitly accused me of making the first attack on you, which is false as stated so many times. You accused us of using tough arm tactics. You accused us of not be willing to accept any criticism, which is a contradiction since that is exactly what we were allowing you to do. You threatened a lawsuit. You accused Brian of making posts that favor the site, rather than me this time, which again is erroneous as we have not engaged in such tactics.


Sun Aug 26 - Brian at BatSpeed.com emailed you twice


Brian informed you by email that we intended to credit your total purchase price, including all shipping charges, since you appeared so dissatisfied, and Brian asked you to destroy the tape since you were not asked to return it. Your credit card was credited in full the same day. Furthermore, Brian indicated that I would be responding to several posts, including yours. Brian and I had a miscommunication over the phone as I informed him that I would be responding to several posts, but not yours. I did not inform Brian that I would respond to rahlking7 (you) as I never intended to respond to you because of your statements against me. We apologize for our miscommunication if you were still anticipating responses from me.


Though Brian's emails were conciliatory as you suggested, at no point did he suggest that we wanted for you to begin posting on the discussion board again. We believed that the situation could be resolved if you were given all of you money back; given one final opportunity, after many had been given, to voice any comments that you may have had; and if we allowed your current posts to remain on the discussion board.


Mon Aug 27 - You posted three additional messages on the discussion board, despite our requests


To my amazement, you then made three additional posts, wherein you stated that you believed that you could now post responses on the discussion board after receiving the emails and receiving a credit for the full purchase price of the instructional video, but no such reference was made in Brian's emails. Maybe it is possible that you believed that you could post since you were told that I would respond to you, however, as stated, this was a miscommunication. Based on this possible misunderstanding, your three posts on this day remained on the discussion board. Furthermore, you stated that it would be up to "Brian's ethics" to decide if you would be "censored" or not. I do not believe that was a fair comment to allege, if in fact you were trying to make "reasonable" posts as you suggested. It appears to me that you were merely trying to cause more dissension.


Mon Aug 27 - I responded to you as stated above


Based on all of the previous statements that I read from you and taken as a whole, I believe that I fairly stated that you questioned my honor and integrity and called me a cheat and a liar. I believe that was the overall message that you were trying to make throughout your posts about me. I also asked you to burn the tape, and Brian also asked you to destroy the tape since you were not asked to return it, but Brian informed you that it would be up to you to decide. Obviously, I did not intend for you to take me literally, but I think that you have a moral obligation to return it, give it away or destroy it since your money has been returned in full.


Mon Aug 27 - You emailed us


In an email to us, you indicated that you were mischaracterized in that you did not refer to me directly as a liar and a cheat. As I stated above, I believe your portrayal of the statements that you levied against me and BatSpeed.com were accurate in their totality when all of your statements are read as a whole. Nevertheless, I am taking this opportunity to detail my reasons for this post so that you and other viewers may have an understanding as to its context.


Conclusion


It is simply not possible for you to continue posting on this board. I cannot in good conscience respond to your posts after the comments that you have been made about me. I believe that you may continue to allege that we at BatSpeed.com are engaging in wrongful activity, which is utterly false, by doing the things that you alleged above. As we stated, we acted in good faith by offering your money back and then credited your card for the full purchase price, without asking you to return the tape. We have given you several opportunities to express yourself and none of your posts have been deleted. Notably, there are discussion boards that teach similar methods to those that you appear to believe in and they may fit your batting approach better than BatSpeed.com.


Lastly, you have not appreciated some of the posts that were directed at you on the site, although none of the negative comments were from Batspeed.com or me, and I have not appreciated the manner in which you have referred to me as stated herein. However, it is still our belief that both parties can simply agree to forever disagree and can walk away as gentlemen so that you can get back to training your son and we can get back to running a professional company that we believe will help players become better hitters for years to come. We hope that you do not take the unfortunate path and pursue this matter, in which case BatSpeed.com will have no other alternative but to defend itself to the fullest extent possible and assert all rights on its own behalf, because in the most basic form this involves a parent and a son, and a good group of people who are operating a website that is dedicated to the assisting people just like yourself in developing their understanding of the baseball and softball swing. Understandably, as it furthers all interests involved, we hope that you will choose to agree to disagree, and let this matter rest.


Jack Mankin and BatSpeed.com




Followups:

Post a followup:
Name:
E-mail:
Subject:
Text:

Anti-Spambot Question:
This song is traditionally sung during the 7th inning stretch?
   All My Roudy Friends
   Take Me Out to the Ballgame
   I Wish I was in Dixie
   Hail to the Chief

   
[   SiteMap   ]